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Important Please Vote


David
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Do You Want U23s   

18 members have voted

  1. 1. Do You Want U23s on FMFA?

    • Yes
      15
    • No
      3


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Right then we changed the U23 this season to a new format but before we review it and decide if it is ok or needs changing we need to decide if we want to keep the u23s

 

Currently anywhere between 9 and 12 managers don't sheet and just take the 442N sheet. That is nearly half the managers so the bigger question is do you want U23s?

 

Can you all please vote so we know the strength of feeling on it.

 

 

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It's not as simple as a yes/no vote. It's not working in its current guise. Having U23s makes FMFA different to most other ESMS games but surely the whole point of the U23s is to try and develop talent for the first team. The gap is massive now and a 25 rater won't touch most sides first 11s. Therefore players are being developed to be sold on when old enough. It's also difficult to manage as so many players rate up and leave the U23 squad decimated. This season is probably the worst so far for that.

 

I don't care that most managers don't sheet, that's up to them, but if spending time on the U23s helps the 1st team then most would make the effort I am sure. 

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I think it's really difficult to set the integration from U23 to first team at the right level as you either end up with:

a) Loads of deadwood that are too good for U23 but nowhere near first team

b) Overpowered youth players in your first team

 

At the moment, from my perspective, it is very heavily in favour of point a, in the fact that I put a lot of minutes into a few youths over the season and now they don't get a kick in the first team as they are too far adrift. I've become a bit distracted from actually spending time on my youths this year through one thing and another, and to be honest I probably wouldn't be sad to see them go personally. However, for those that do spend the time sheeting every round and nurturing their U23 teams properly, there should definitely be some reward.

 

Just an idea, but is it worth having the leagues restructured so that managers who want to sheet can be in one league, and the clubs who have a low or 0% sheeting rate this year are put in another division? Therefore you get the competition for those who want to invest their time in it, but also for those who just don't sheet it won't have an impact on the season? For example, I haven't sheeted much, but I did in a few odd games recently and it may have cost sides who expected us to play a default tactic? It's probably not the best approach, but just hanging ideas out there

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Right guys they are all valid opinions/comments.

 

But before we can look at what changes we nee to make to the league we need to look at do we want it.

If the majority don't then the issues of deadwood, progression etc. are irrelevant and I don't want to waste time on sorting it out for better or to suit what we need to find it is something most don't want. 

 

Once we know managers want the U23s then we can look at changes to the structure etc.

 

By all means put any thoughts ideas in here though as they help if we come to the point of wanting to keep U23s and then want ideas thoughts on change.

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i do like the u23s to develop my players but like others have said i have players in my team i cant use to high for the unders but 2 low for the 1st team plus it annoys me when i spend my time sheeting other managers dont bother then you go and lose so at this current format no i wouldnt like to keep it 

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If anyone's interested i'll cop these stats here:

 

U21s

Pl   Team                      P    W   D   L    GF   GA   GD   Pts
-------------------------------------------------------------------
1    Everton_U23s             11    5   4   2    17    8    9    19 - 1 x 442N (1 draw)
2    Southampton_U23s         11    5   4   2    15   11    4    19 - 7 x 442N (4 win, 2 draw, 1 loss)
3    Aston_Villa_U23s         11    6   1   4    13   12    1    19
4    Liverpool_U23s           11    3   7   1    14    7    7    16
5    Leicester_City_U23s      11    3   5   3    11   11    0    14 - 6 x 442N (1 win, 4 draw, 1 loss)
6    Burnley_U23s             11    2   5   4     9   10   -1    11 - 11 x 442N (2 win, 5 draw, 4 loss)
7    Sheffield_United_U23s    11    3   1   7    12   22  -10    10 - 11 x 442N (3 win, 1 draw, 7 loss)
8    Newcastle_United_U23s    11    1   5   5     5   15  -10     8 - 1 x 442N (1 loss)

442N Performance - P37 W10 D13 L14 (so if you don't sheet you win over 25% and don't lose over 60%)
Sheeting Rate - 60% (the Ns for Everton and Newcastle were due to 2 errors so not counting them for sheeting rate)

 

Pl   Team                      P    W   D   L    GF   GA   GD   Pts
-------------------------------------------------------------------
1    West_Ham_United_U23s     14    7   4   3    18    8   10    25 - 1 x 442N (1 win)
2    Arsenal_U23s             14    7   2   5    19   17    2    23
-------------------------------------------------------------------
3    Manchester_Utd_U23s      13    5   4   4    18   18    0    19 - 12 x 442N (5 win, 4 draw, 3 loss)
4    Crystal_Palace_U23s      13    5   3   5    16   11    5    18
5    Stoke_City_U23s          13    5   3   5    13   18   -5    18 - 13 x 442N (5 win, 3 draw, 5 loss)
6    QPR_U23s                 14    4   4   6    14   19   -5    16 - 14 x 442N (4 win, 4 draw, 6 loss)
-------------------------------------------------------------------
7    Watford_U23s             13    3   6   4    10   12   -2    15
8    Bournemouth_U23s         13    3   6   4    16   20   -4    15 - 2 x 442N (1 win, 1 draw)
9    Manchester_City_U23s     13    3   4   6    13   14   -1    13 - 1 x 442N (1 loss)

442N Performance - P43 W16 D12 L15 (so if you don't sheet you win over 37% and don't lose over 65%)
Sheeting Rate - 64% 

 

Pl   Team                      P    W   D   L    GF   GA   GD   Pts
-------------------------------------------------------------------
1    Brentford_U23s           14    7   4   3    18   10    8    25
2    Derby_County_U23s        13    7   2   4    21   12    9    23
-------------------------------------------------------------------
3    Tottenham_Hotspur_U23s   13    6   5   2    16    8    8    23 - 2 x 442N (1 win, 1 loss)
4    Leeds_United_U23s        14    6   4   4    24   13   11    22 - 13 x 442N (5 win, 4 draw, 4 loss)
5    Chelsea_U23s             13    5   2   6    21   25   -4    17 - 4 x 442N (2 win, 2 loss)
6    Norwich_City_U23s        13    4   4   5    14   18   -4    16
-------------------------------------------------------------------
7    Brighton_U23s            13    4   3   6    20   21   -1    15 - 7 x 442N (3 win, 2 draw, 2 loss)
8    Wolverhampton_U23s       13    3   4   6    11   24  -13    13 - 13 x 442N (3 win, 4 draw, 6 loss)
9    West_Bromwich_U23s       14    1   6   7    11   25  -14     9

442N Performance - P39 W14 D10 L15 (so if you don't sheet you win over 35% and don't lose over 61%)
Sheeting Rate - 67% 

 

Overall 442N Performance  - P119 W40 D35 L44 (approx 1 third end in wins and you'll avoid defeat if you don't sheet 63% of the time)

Overall Sheeting Rate - 64%

 

For me it's good that the teams at the top of each table are regular sheeters (with the exception of Southampton in the Prem) and we get roughly 2 out of every 3 sheets submitted which I think shows interest.

 

Non - sheeting for U23s seems to get you a lower to mid table spot on average. Not sure this is right - I think, again, taking the subs off the 442Ns would impact this

 

 

 

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I voted yes. I submit sheets regularly and I enjoy developing players.

 

I agree with the above comments however.

a) The current format has no point. I spent a bit of time and effort in previous seasons to develop several youths who had pretty good potential. I've only kept a couple and sold a couple a more. I haven't brought myself to the point of selling the remainder to FMFA but unfortunately I think some will have to. Also I am currently developing some more in the youth team who don't have any kind of future. It kills the enjoyment though when there's no point to it.

 

and

b) I don't care if other managers sheet or not - that's their prerogative and it doesn't change how I feel about developing players.

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64% sheeting rate does show interest is there to me.

 

The new shop item for rating up players when promoted has worked for me - players i've used them on have played in my seniors. It's the first season of that so could be tweaked.

 

If you look at what's available you can increase a players main by 2 per season whilst a youth and 3 secondaries plus then by up to 2 when they rank up. So you could take, for example:

 

A_Defender     20 eng  1 22  9  4 19 300  900 300 300

and make him the following in a few games:

A_Defender     20 eng  1 27 11  4 19 300   1 300 300

 

if you use what's available correctly. Granted it's cost 26m credits but you don't get something for nothing.

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9 minutes ago, Nocky said:

64% sheeting rate does show interest is there to me.

 

The new shop item for rating up players when promoted has worked for me - players i've used them on have played in my seniors. It's the first season of that so could be tweaked.

 

If you look at what's available you can increase a players main by 2 per season whilst a youth and 3 secondaries plus then by up to 2 when they rank up. So you could take, for example:

 

A_Defender     20 eng  1 22  9  4 19 300  900 300 300

and make him the following in a few games:

A_Defender     20 eng  1 27 11  4 19 300   1 300 300

 

if you use what's available correctly. Granted it's cost 26m credits but you don't get something for nothing.

Thanks, I wasn't aware that this was how it worked. I have a few that could benefit here and would just about then see some first team footy.

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I don't care if it is kept or not, if it is there I will sheet to maximise the minimal benefit it gives.

 

Part of the problem as I see it no one needs it to produce players for their senior squads with auctions and scouting largely providing enough to replace the few retirees there are each season and at the same time it doesn't produce players that are good enough to force their way into senior squads.

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23 hours ago, Nocky said:

64% sheeting rate does show interest is there to me.

 

The new shop item for rating up players when promoted has worked for me - players i've used them on have played in my seniors. It's the first season of that so could be tweaked.

 

If you look at what's available you can increase a players main by 2 per season whilst a youth and 3 secondaries plus then by up to 2 when they rank up. So you could take, for example:

 

A_Defender     20 eng  1 22  9  4 19 300  900 300 300

and make him the following in a few games:

A_Defender     20 eng  1 27 11  4 19 300   1 300 300

 

if you use what's available correctly. Granted it's cost 26m credits but you don't get something for nothing.

 

I wasn't really aware of this either, and it's certainly something that could benefit a lot of teams if they are willing to generate the credits. Thanks Alex

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I've read through the comments and thought to myself are people making enough effort??

 

I have managed to develop at least 3 players that have come through my youth team and become 1st team players.

It can be done if you put in the effort.

Are the managers that don't bother sheeting for the under 23s writing match build ups and reports??

Getting credits by doing this will also help with developing players.

 

I understand that for the top teams in the Prem this is more of an issue as the gap from u23s to 1st team is a lot wider but there is nothing stopping them from developing players and selling them on.

 

As a side note, in CoE I try and make the top 3 divisions of u23s for teams whose managers regulary sheet to try and keep the competitive nature of the league and I also try and keep the divisions small with equal teams in them, although that is not always possible.

 

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17 hours ago, Dazoctaron said:

I've read through the comments and thought to myself are people making enough effort??

 

 

I've got 1 youth who managed to make it to the seniors for regular game time: D_Quina

I've got a 2nd (R_Suckling) who I'm looking to persist with.

 

I've sold on 3 - J_Mukena, G_McEachran and A_Tuanzebe

 

I've got some in the U23 team: D_Hutchins, T_Ebanks, D_Moonan & M_Caisutti who I want to keep developing and hoping that some will make the first team. I can't use credits to help Hutchins but age (and re-rates) should be on his side. Hoping to use credits for the other 3.

 

I've also got T_Leighton who wont sell, and J_David and T_Akinola who probably wont sell either seeing how I can't sell L_Martinez. Working with those 3 has been wasted effort and credits which is a shame. It's why I'm persisting with Suckling otherwise he'd be another player were I wasted effort and credits.

 

 

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Right, for now I'm out of the game (but having in mind to come back soon if I can) and I like U23s. During my time as Crystal Palace's manager I enjoyed it so much despite the results. So my vote is a big YES, I do want U23s into FMFA.

 

The changes this system could need are in your hands (admins) and I'm sure you will execute what it's the best for FMFA. I trust in your criteria.

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